For Noob steelheaders

Salmo_g

WFF Supporter
I saw in the latest Daniel Ocean thread that there are a few other steelhead newbies. Some of you are making some of the same mistakes Daniel did. That must mean that you didn't read his first thread titled "A newbie's log" from a year and a half ago. There's a lotta' good stuff in it, some I posted and some by others.

One thing that I don't remember being in it that one of the current crop of newbs mentions is fishing nearly 30 rivers. That's a mistake. Pick maybe two rivers. Learn the most productive locations on those two rivers and fish them repeatedly until you either catch a few fish, or those spots are no longer on the list of most productive locations.

What follows is a bunch of my posts in response to Daniel's questions. If you follow the advice and can't catch a steelhead, it's because, a. you can't cast worth shit; b. you can't wade worth shit; c. you can't read water worth shit; d. you don't fish worth shit; or e. there are no steelhead there.

Thread dredge from 2013:

Daniel,

Since you found this website and forum, that means you have internet access. Use that before you fish. You went out driving yesterday and saw that the river was high. If you had checked the river gages on the internet before you left home, you would have known what to expect even before you started your car. Google USGS real time water data, and you can pull up a table of all USGS gages in WA, including the Sky. Bookmark it, and use it. Lots. Never leave home to fish without first checking on water levels.

Good looking fly box. You can buy more flies, lots more. It won't improve your likelihood of catching a steelhead one iota. You can take that comment to the bank. Most any fly will do provided you present in properly in the right place. You can read a lot in books and online here about proper presentations that can help you. The right place is where a steelhead is, when a steelhead is there. If you already know what steelhead holding water looks like and how to find it, you're set. If you don't, then that's what you need to focus on, not on what rod, what fly, and all the other all but irrelevant shit that most newbs obsess about. Notice I didn't include "line" in that short list. Using a line that is suited to the proper presentation I mentioned can make the difference between hooking up and not. Until you have a damn good reason to use something else, I recommend a WF line with a 15' sink tip in type VI sinking rate. A multi-tip line might be a good investment, and then you could have a floating, type III, and type VI tip to cover the vast majority of fishing conditions.

Put this in your fishing log, and good luck.

Sg

Daniel,

One more thing, regarding waders. Decent waders are more important to a steelhead fly fisherman's success than a good rod. Decent casts can be had with a crummy rod, but if you can't wade to the right position, you ain't likely to make the proper presentation I referred to in my earlier post.

Sg

Daniel,

Congrats on your new rod acquisition. Had I seen your earlier post I would have advised you to keep and fish the TFO. There's nothing wrong with the Sage rod, but at what appears to be your stage of the game, I'll just tell you that you're wearing a $240 smile on your face and have done nothing to up your steelheading game.

Let me share that I have quite a few rods. They range in price from $59 Cabela's Three Forks models to a $2,200 Bob Clay bamboo that I was fortunate to obtain for slightly less. The expensive rods, the bamboo ones anyway, do put a smile on my face, and I love casting and fishing with them. However they do not make me a better angler, even in the slightest.

I suggest that you add this post to your fishing log. As long as money is an issue, I recommend that you invest in products and services that will up your game. When the money doesn't matter, that is the best time to invest in putting a smile on your face that doesn't improve your fishing.

Sg

Daniel.

Most fly fishermen are crazy, so don't worry. You're in good company altho your wife may disagree. I think the place you need to begin is with an 8 wt rod that you like to cast. If you don't know how to fly cast, then whatever 8 wt a casting instructor says isn't a POS will do fine for starters. I'm not familiar with your specific rod, but I can't imagine that the TFO Pro won't serve you well.

What I meant by products and services that will up your game is things like instead of buying a $400 rod, buy a $100 rod and $300 worth of casting lessons. Same cost, but the latter will put you many miles ahead. An expensive rod is a lousy investment for a person who can't cast worth shit. And good rods don't make newbs into good casters. Most any ole rod and instruction and practice to develop good technique is what makes a good caster.

Now that you've got a rod, you need a line. Unlike fly rods, the cheapest fly lines are unwise investments. The good news is that you don't need the most expensive line either. My rule of thumb is to avoid lines of lesser quality than SA Air Cell Supreme (which may be discontinued, so whatever replaced it) and Cortland 444 Peach floating lines are high quality, durable, have slick finishes that cast well.

The cheapest reel that I know of and will vouch as steelhead serviceable is the Pflueger Medalist. Size 1495 will hold 100 yd of 20# dacron backing and a WF8F line. I have 3 Pfluegers, but confess to not using them. I've spent untold dollars on reels that put a smile on my face, but they don't play and land steelhead any better.

When you get a reel, get a spare spool. You could buy a multi-tip fly line and have one reel with one spool, but life is more fun with a floating line that doesn't have the tip section looped on. The second spool should have a floating line, either cut and looped for multiple tip sections or make your own. DIY is what I've been doing for decades, so I don't own any store bought multi-tip lines except a Spey line I won in a raffle. I like an SA Air Cell Supreme cut back 15' from the tip and looped. There are numerous ways to do this. My way is simple and works well. Dip the line in acetone (nail polish remover) and strip about 2 1/2" of PVC finish off. Fray 1/2" of the nylon line core to separate the fibers. Wind and whip finish 1/2 to 5/8" with fly tying thread to form a loop. The wound part is stiff, and the loop is droopy and limp. Coat the whole shebang with Pliobond cement, let dry, then add a second coat. Now the loop is pliable but stiff enough to not hinge when casting. Make a floating tip with the section you cut off. Make, or just buy some 15' RIO sink tips in Type III, VI, and VIII. Add 4' of 10# Maxima leader material, knot a fly to the tippet, and you're set to fish.

Sg

Daniel Ocean asked: Okay guys heres my next question. Are the fighting butt's on your rods a necessary thing to have or can you live without them?

Sg replied:

Unnecessary, but if you're gonn'a have one, make it 5" long. The 2" ones are practically a waste of space.

After a gratifying 5 fish day with no fighting butt, I was complaining about how my elbow tendonitis was giving me a fit. My friend strongly suggested I stop complaining about something that "hurt so good."

Sg

DO asked about wading boots.

I haven't tried vibram soled wading boots yet. Anglers I know who use them only used them with studs or cleats. I wear felt soled or studded felt soled boots. And that's what I would wear on the Sky.

Sg

Daniel,

People report great satisfaction with Simm's Guide boots. I looked at them and think they're god-awful heavy. I've been wearing Patagonias for several years. Very light and comfortable, but they just don't last. So I recently bought the Simm's Headwaters, their lightest weight model. A couple friends report that they are comfortable and durable. I haven't used them yet. I'm thinking about installing studs first. They're available either in felt or vibram sole.

In the interests of entertainment I recommend reading the books others have mentioned. But if you want to learn how to fish for steelhead, I recommend reading "How to fish good for steelhead" by Salmo g. Except it isn't finished or available, except for the parts included in this thread and others over the years on the WFF board. You should get together with Francis and see if some of your sense of humor rubs off on him. He's a bit sensitive to my assholish insults when all I was trying to do was help him out, well, and keep this site entertaining.

Sg

Daniel,

Thanks for the beer offer. That's forthright and good. But please understand and make note in your logbook that wine coolers are illegal among steelheaders.

As for your Okuma, if the spool spins round 'n round without falling off, and the handle doesn't break off, it's good enough to land a steelhead on. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but steelhead are way fuckin' over-rated. They are not dorado, roosterfish, or marlin. Maybe a little bit like baby tarpon, but only on a good day. When I was an impoverished college student I bought fly reels at Goodwill for $3 apiece. And they landed steelhead. Even when the pawl eroded into metal shavings and the spool handle broke off, I still landed that hot summer run, along with a memory I will never forget. That wouldn't have happened with a $15 Pflueger Medalist.

On the marriage advice front, fishing isn't the cause of divorce. Needy wives who want their husband to hang with them 24/7/365 are one cause. If your wife is, you might as well dump her now and get it over with because no human should have to life a suffocating life. Another major cause often blamed on fishing is lazy husbands who can't or won't live up to their slightly more than 50% of the marriage bargain even while taking the time necessary for fishing to be a major part of your life. If that is you, your wife will dump you sooner or later. That can be avoided by making the time you are together so satisfying and rewarding that she agrees that fishing helps define who you are. Just understand that fishing, in and of itself, does not cause divorce. Put this in your logbook too.

Sg

Is that the public access immediately downstream of the Lewis St. bridge? I haven't seen that spot in a few years, and last time I did, it didn't look like prime holding water. However, rivers are always changing, and a spot that's good one year isn't the next, and junk water can become a hotspot.

Sg

Daniel,

It really sucks to learn that you can't cast only after you're on the water for a day's fishing. Lawn casting WITH THE GEAR YOU'RE GOING TO FISH WITH really helps, minus the hook anyway. Use a fly and cut the hook off at the bend. How heavy a fly? If you're just learning to cast, I recommend avoiding weighted flies, and if your rod is an 8 wt, make your largest fly a size 4, unweighted. Once you already know how to cast is the time to experiment with larger and heavier flies. BTW, are you casting a poly leader on the end of a standard, unmodified WF8F? If so, that could be part of your lousy casting. I think I already posted a sink tip line that casts and fishes easier/better in this log. You should read it; lotta' good info.

Welcome to 21st century fishing. There are 3 times as many people but exactly the same amount of water as 40 years ago, and more of it is posted.

Trout fishing is easier than steelheading only because there are more trout around than there are steelhead. Plus trout actively feed, so presenting a fly that imitates natural food in a near natural way ups the odds a whole lot.

Dressing appropriately only matters if you're not in your teens or twenties. That's why one of my first chapters is how to dress like a fisherman, from the skin out. Hydration is important. I used to drink river water, but a nasty case of giardia cured me of that. I always pack a water bottle and some beer in warm weather. A flask of whisky in the cooler months is nice also.

Sg

I haven't used a RIO versitip line so have no personal opinion. But not everyone likes them, but that could be said about any sink tip. All I know is that I have made and comfortably used many sink tip lines from standard WF*F lines cut and looped or spliced at 15' from the tip. Even simpler, except for more splices, is splicing a favored running line, then 15' of level 8 or whatever weight, then splice on or loop a sinking tip. Easy to cast and fish. You have so much energy for this endeavor you should consider giving this a try.

Oh, BTW, that's right about slowing down and opening your loop if casting weighted flies.

Sg

PS: fishing around the Lewis St bridge is such a newb move. There's good water upstream and downstream from there. A ways.

Daniel,

A 4' leader off your sink tip is just fine, at least until low super clear water happens later in the summer. The double or triple surgeon's loops I tie in leader material suck for strength, don't know why. So I put 1' of 12 or 15# Maxima on the end of my sink tip, then add 3' of 10# Maxima Ultra-green leader.

Sorry about having to cut up your $75 line. I avoid that problem by buying cheaper fly lines. SA Air Cell Supreme is only $30. You could buy a perfectly satisfactory line from Hook & Hackle or Allen Fishing for about that price and save your $75 line for strictly floating line applications if you haven't cut it already.

Sg

Daniel,

BTW, sore shoulder is indicative of poor casting form. Even old farts like me with elbow and shoulder ailments can cast from can't see in the morning til can't see at night without the joints acting up. Therefore I again recommend that you work on your casting technique.

Not sure about the blisters tho. You ever use your hands for anything?

Sg

Daniel,

It was with great restraint that I didn't make a joke about your blisters. But I want to protect my reputation for always making my posts in good taste.

If you prowl around a bit, you can probably get a casting lesson or two for free, so don't fail to investigate that possibility.

Fly tying is a good addiction too. It's kept me from countless nights in bars and made me a better husband and father, with the side benefit that my small children and the cat learned not to put stray hooks into their mouths. I'm not sure what the cheap AA vice is - is it an addiction to cheap drugs or booze? -, but my ex gave me a Thompson A vise in 1974, and I'm still tying on it even tho I was given a Regal a few years ago by a co-worker who moved away.

Sg

Daniel,

I'm sure I have vices as well, but I think you're talking about vises when referring to the device that holds hooks for fly tying, or that bolt to your workbench for that matter. Yeah, I took up fly tying to save money too. Sometimes that notion seems questionable; however I think it actually has worked out in my favor, just not to the degree I originally estimated.

Like Cuponoodle mentioned, a lot of new casters think they need to make 37 false casts for each cast delivered to the lawn or water. That is one way to wear out the arm prematurely, plus all the time that line is in the air, the fly is not fishing, except for bats around dusk.

Sg

Daniel,

A good angler I know has fished the NF Stilly 5 times since the opener with no success yet. Last year he'd caught 4 by this time. It varies from year to year.

Sorry about your flies falling apart. Could be a quality issue, but are you positive that your casting technique is not a contributing factor? We learned some posts ago that you've got some issues there. I would expect even cheap flies, particularly ones from a shop, to last through a few days of fishing.

Sg

Daniel,

Anytime the wife is critical of things fishing related, just ask her how many purses and pairs of shoes she has. That should end it. Good luck tying more bait.

Sg

Daniel,

The fish are already in water, so they don't ". . . enters the water they are very silverish in color." The coloration of steelhead is a combination of environmental factors and sexual maturity. As pelagic ocean fish, a good environmental strategy is to be dark on top (steel blue) so that overhead predators don't see them standing out against the dark depths of the sea. And the flip side - literally - is that a snow white belly does not stand out much against the sky to predators lurking beneath them. Steelhead generally enter freshwater in their ocean colors, unless they are late winter steelhead already exhibiting advanced sexual maturity. In the latter cases, steelhead may show the beginnings up to advance stages of their spawning colors, depending on how close in time they are to spawning. Summer steelhead retain their ocean colors longer because they are months to a year away from spawning. Summer steelhead gradually assume colors more like a resident trout, with an olive green back replacing the steel blue that they left the ocean with. Smalma posted some time ago about how summer steelhead that get quite trout colored through the summer months as the rivers drop and clear can then brighten up a bit in response to fall rains and higher flows. Eventually sexual maturity will cause them to darken up and assume their spawning colors. After spawning, steelhead begin to brighten up on their return to the ocean. Well, mainly females do. Males mostly remain colored up and continue searching for more unspawned females and don't often survive to make it back out to sea.

Don't go getting yourself all excited about the Skeena country. The Canadian are doing what they can to discourage NRAs (non-resident aliens) from steelhead fishing in BC. They have increased license fees, require an additional $60 steelhead conservation license, and an additional $20 to $40 per day classified waters license to fish any of the best and most popular summer-fall steelhead rivers in the Skeena system and elsewhere. In addition, the Kispiox Band now charges a $100 per person daily access fee to fish the best steelhead holding water on the lower Kispiox. Oh, and did I mention, NRAs cannot fish most steelhead areas on weekends, only weekdays. Guide days are in limited supply, so guides don't often do onesey - twosey guided day trips. Most want to book for 3 or 4 day minimums. And steelhead lodges run $7,000 to $8,000 a week. It's not a bad deal, but ya' really gotta' want to do it.

Sg

Y'er sick Daniel. Take some medicine. Didn't you say you're out of work? Unless you're independently wealthy, that's not a good time to be a gear whore. Learn to cast and fish what you've got. Experience and skill will help you make better informed choices when you choose your next fly rod.

Daniel,

It's OK. Everyone makes mistakes. Smart people learn from their mistakes. I'm a pretty intelligent guy. Just imagine all the mistakes I've made!

A word or two about sharing fishing locations, or fishing intel as it's sometimes referred to. That is called "kiss and tell" fishing, or fish and tell, more accurately. Here's the scoop on that topic, distilled from decades of real life real time experience of thousands of conscientious anglers.

If you, all on your own, discover or happen upon a spot that you determine is a good place to fish, you are entitled to share information about that spot with whomever you wish. You can even post about it on the internet, although you should think about just how many hundreds or thousands of people you're sharing that info with, and how many of them you would like to see standing in that very spot the next time you go there to fish it.

For example, early in my steelhead fly fishing career I was driving and prowling around the NF Stilly and discovered the WDFW access parking lot to the Fortson Hole. I parked and walked down the trail to the river and determined that it was a pretty good place to fish (and in 1972 it was!). By the written and unwritten rules of the International Order of Anglers I can share that knowledge with anyone, and I have, since it turned out that Fortson was an extremely popular and well known hatchery blood hole often written about in newspapers and fishing rags.

Then there's places like the ****** Hole on another river that a fishing friend showed me, the side road that leads to a small parking spot, and the not so easy to follow trail through the woods and across a slough to get to a nice long run that fishes well. As a matter of tradition, respect, angling friendship, and common sense when you come to understand it, I cannot, will not, show or tell about to any other person that location without first obtaining permission from the friend who first showed it to me. This does not prevent dissemination of fishing location information, but it controls the rate at which it is spread around.

If you think what I've written above is weird or strange in any way, I suggest you read Cuponoodle Breakfast's post. The number of rivers in WA state had not increased in the last century or millenium. However the state's human population has nearly tripled in the last 40 years. The finite number of good fishing holes is getting smaller, not larger. No angler of experience and integrity ever shares location intel with a kiss and tell fisherman out of obvious self interest.

And the above doesn't even touch the topic of the self satisfaction derived from making personal discoveries.

Sg

Holy Batshit! Daniel collided with a steelhead!

BTW, setting the hook is generally unnecessary when wet fly fishing for steelhead, just sweep the rod toward the shore and hang on. Also, hooking steelhead on the hang down is a very low percentage affair, to get the occasional hook up that way, don't set the hook - that just pulls the fly out of their mouth - instead feed 2 or 3' of line out so they can take the fly and turn to return to their lie. Then if the line tightens, set up.

Congratulations sucker!

Sg

About steelhead flies:

My steelhead fly mantra is "any fly is good, as long as it's black." Unless I'm using a fly of a different color. I mean, God gave us many colors, so why should I use black all the time? Think about fly selection. Don't over-think fly selection. Don't start talking like this matters more than it does.

Sg

D.O.,

Get a hiking/wading staff and lose 65 pounds if your doc says to lose 50. Docs tend not to be brutal enough, except when they say, "here, this won't hurt." Anyway, back to the point, fly fishing is way too important to be compromised by poor health. Make a deal with yourself that will really help your fishing: no more new rods until you lose the first 50. Besides, your wife will think yer hot.

Sg
 

KerryS

Ignored Member
Pretty comprehensive Salmo.

I would add hang around experienced steelheaders as much as possible. You will learn more observing someone who knows what they are doing than trying to teach yourself. Do whatever it takes to get experienced fishermen to take you fishing. Buy them breakfast, pay for the gas, buy them beer, buy them cigars, buy them scotch, buy them hookers or if your wife is hot offer them her. Anything to get them to allow you to tag along on the next fishing trip and the one after that. Asks as many questions you think you can get away with then ask some more. Watch everything they do. How they put their rod together. What leader they use. What tip they put on. What fly they tie on. Where in the run they start fishing. How far they cast. When they take a piss. Ask questions about all of it until someone tells you to shut the fuck up then ask one more.
 

Rob Allen

Active Member
Good post.

My primary argument though would be that the reason people struggle to catch steelhead is D. " There are no steelhead".

We can talk till we are blue in the face about tackle,techniques, flies and knowledge but the primary and overriding problem with catching steelhead in the state of Washington is that we have used and abused the resource so badly that there are not enough fish to make for good fishing.
Those who find tiny spots where fish meet a lack of people are tight lipped about them and rightly so. If they blabbed it would be destroyed.

I wouldn't want to be a noon steelheader these days for anything.
 

David Dalan

69°19'15.35" N 18°44'22.74" E
Salmo hit the nail on the head at the top. Pick a river (MAYBE 2) and find all the skunk report information you can, find people who have fished and make them show you around. Shorten that learning curve. Learn to read water. Once you have a feel for where the fish may lie, and what you may need to do to get your bug in their face...go on a world tour.

I am among the class of people who had to learn the hard way. It wasn't until way too late in life that I connected with a couple of experienced steelheaders who had pity on me and put me in the know, and I began to dish out the punishment.

Then I took up flyfishing for them and went back to occasional long dry spells :)

No steelhead left...? Well...some places. However, at other places there are folks putting 75 fish a month to the boat/bank.

Unless you live between Everett and Olympia. Then...to quote the inter webs "j00r teh fux0red."
 
B

bennysbuddy

Pretty comprehensive Salmo.

I would add hang around experienced steelheaders as much as possible. You will learn more observing someone who knows what they are doing than trying to teach yourself. Do whatever it takes to get experienced fishermen to take you fishing. Buy them breakfast, pay for the gas, buy them beer, buy them cigars, buy them scotch, buy them hookers or if your wife is hot offer them her. Anything to get them to allow you to tag along on the next fishing trip and the one after that. Asks as many questions you think you can get away with then ask some more. Watch everything they do. How they put their rod together. What leader they use. What tip they put on. What fly they tie on. Where in the run they start fishing. How far they cast. When they take a piss. Ask questions about all of it until someone tells you to shut the fuck up then ask one more.
I tried all of this , and still I had to learn it all the hard way
 

doublespey

Steelhead-a-holic
Pretty comprehensive Salmo.

I would add hang around experienced steelheaders as much as possible. You will learn more observing someone who knows what they are doing than trying to teach yourself. Do whatever it takes to get experienced fishermen to take you fishing. Buy them breakfast, pay for the gas, buy them beer, buy them cigars, buy them scotch, buy them hookers or if your wife is hot offer them her. Anything to get them to allow you to tag along on the next fishing trip and the one after that. Asks as many questions you think you can get away with then ask some more. Watch everything they do. How they put their rod together. What leader they use. What tip they put on. What fly they tie on. Where in the run they start fishing. How far they cast. When they take a piss. Ask questions about all of it until someone tells you to shut the fuck up then ask one more.

And finally, one last reason you follow an experienced Steelheader around = CONFIDENCE. Most newbies virgins have little confidence that they're "doing it right". They change their sinktips after 15 minutes without a take because they don't think their fly is deep enough. Change their fly from bright to dark to flashy. Fish plug water (fast and deep) because nothing is taking in the prime fly water. All these pseudo-strategies waste time and diminish your chances of catching your first steelhead. Following an experienced steelheader should convince them that the 'secret' is to keep your fly swimming in good water until a steelhead finds it.
 

Charles Sullivan

Active Member
And finally, one last reason you follow an experienced Steelheader around = CONFIDENCE. Most newbies virgins have little confidence that they're "doing it right". They change their sinktips after 15 minutes without a take because they don't think their fly is deep enough. Change their fly from bright to dark to flashy. Fish plug water (fast and deep) because nothing is taking in the prime fly water. All these pseudo-strategies waste time and diminish your chances of catching your first steelhead. Following an experienced steelheader should convince them that the 'secret' is to keep your fly swimming in good water until a steelhead finds it.

I think that you are correct in many ways.

Time has a way of bending memories too. Also confidence comes with success witch breeds more success.

I was thinking of the paradigm of steelhead success and confidence the evening after the O S event and after reading Malcolm Gladwells book, Blink. I had a few Eureka moments. The pain Meds stripped me of some of the thoughts, but the upshot is that you should read the book and we can discuss it at the next OS event.

My back is doing better too. I'll fish this weekend, but only the water that I have a good feeling about.

Go Sox,
Cds
 

C&CRods

not your average member
Side note- I fished nearly 30 rivers last year because I love exploring and have found so many of my favorite spots doing so. This has the obvious effect of decreasing fish numbers, but I wouldn't trade the last couple years for more fish. Thank you for compressing all this fine information though.
 

ChaseBallard

bushwhacker
One thing that I don't remember being in it that one of the current crop of newbs mentions is fishing nearly 30 rivers. That's a mistake. Pick maybe two rivers. Learn the most productive locations on those two rivers and fish them repeatedly until you either catch a few fish, or those spots are no longer on the list of most productive locations.


Sg

THIS. Not that exploring doesn't yield lessons of it's own. But if you want to pop your cherry, pick a river you're confident in and fish the shit out of it. The first four steelies I hooked on the swing came from the exact same run on a local river. Even though they were hooked over several months, they were all holding within 50 feet of each other in water I had learned to swing well.
 

Chawhee

Active Member
I caught a steelhead once. Just once though.

All joking aside though, I love fishing for steelhead.
This fish will test you. It might sound a little silly, but chasing steelhead with a fly rod can reveal things about yourself, your resolve, and mental fortitude.
You can often find anglers fishing in near freezing temperatures, rain, wind, high and dirty water all for perhaps once chance.
This fish will make your doubt yourself, your fly, and method you choose for the pursuit.

It can be seen as a metaphor of sorts. That although the chance of connecting with a steelhead on the fly rod is small ( in comparison to some other methods), there is hope. That the "right" way is most often the hard way.

I can tell you one thing at least. Out of all the fishing and all the fish I have ever caught, I remember each and every steelhead.
 
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SpeySpaz

still an authority on nothing
_G man, you had me at:

" If you follow the advice and can't catch a steelhead, it's because, a. you can't cast worth shit; b. you can't wade worth shit; c. you can't read water worth shit; d. you don't fish worth shit; or e. there are no steelhead there."

I have to confess I skipped reading all the rest of the thread.
regards,
Bob
 

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