Californians attempt to rescue their salmon

GOTY

9x Puget Sound Steelhead Guide of the Year
Right or wrong in regards to this thread is a matter of opinion and in this case I don't share your opinion. If you think the posts I made in this thread is "actively destroying the cause" then I must again question your use of logic or complete lack of. This is beyond rediculas.
You stated that this OS is irrelevant to the end game and are telling people to not show. Meanwhile the other drivers of OS are clamoring for how important it is and are scrounging up people to show. That, by definition, is you actively destroying it.

I'll blame it on the Hawks game and the associated hangover, but damn you're off tonight Kerry.

Good luck
 
Thanks so much, Alosa and Steve! And thanks for the links, Steve! I will check them out.

I was fortunate enough to see condors when I floated the Grand Canyon; they were impressive birds! I also had the privilege of witnessing a condor release at the Vermilion Cliffs a few years ago. It is heartening to think that the same type of applied genetics that brought the condors back from the brink is now being applied to salmon.

I imagine Dr. Garza's (and his team) analysis must be expensive. Still, it makes me wonder how it could be used on populations that are not in as dire straights yet. I wonder if further declines could be prevented/slowed with some thoughtful pairings. A dream come true would be to use this process to identify the residual genetics of the Elwah fish and rebuild the stocks from close relatives. One can fantasize I guess...
I saw two vultures along crab creek and it was an amazing experiance. I didn't know what they were and anxiously got the binoculars out. Cool experience.
 

cabezon

Sculpin Enterprises
WFF Supporter
Thanks so much, Alosa and Steve! And thanks for the links, Steve! I will check them out.

I was fortunate enough to see condors when I floated the Grand Canyon; they were impressive birds! I also had the privilege of witnessing a condor release at the Vermilion Cliffs a few years ago. It is heartening to think that the same type of applied genetics that brought the condors back from the brink is now being applied to salmon.

I imagine Dr. Garza's (and his team) analysis must be expensive. Still, it makes me wonder how it could be used on populations that are not in as dire straights yet. I wonder if further declines could be prevented/slowed with some thoughtful pairings. A dream come true would be to use this process to identify the residual genetics of the Elwah fish and rebuild the stocks from close relatives. One can fantasize I guess...
Hi Freestone,
I don't think that your dream is a fantasy. Dr. Garza's group has identified some of the genetics underlying spawn timing in steelhead [Abadía-Cardoso A, Anderson EC, Pearse DE, Garza JC (2013) Large-scale parentage analysis reveals reproductive patterns and heritability of spawn timing in a hatchery population of steelhead Oncorhynchus mykiss. Molecular Ecology 22:4733-4746.]. And in the fall, I posted an article that described some of the allelic variation in size determination in Atlantic salmon (see http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/11/151104133222.htm). It would be sweet to turn the clock back and see a return of those 80-100lb torpedoes that could conquer the Grand Canyon of the Elwha and spawn in the upper reaches, especially if I can watch them cruise by while I fish the Ranch section of the Elwha....
Steve
 

Freestone

WFF Supporter
And in the fall, I posted an article that described some of the allelic variation in size determination in Atlantic salmon see http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/11/151104133222.htm).
Hi Freestone,
I don't think that your dream is a fantasy. Dr. Garza's group has identified some of the genetics underlying spawn timing in steelhead [Abadía-Cardoso A, Anderson EC, Pearse DE, Garza JC (2013) Large-scale parentage analysis reveals reproductive patterns and heritability of spawn timing in a hatchery population of steelhead Oncorhynchus mykiss. Molecular Ecology 22:4733-4746.]. And in the fall, I posted an article that described some of the allelic variation in size determination in Atlantic salmon (see http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/11/151104133222.htm). It would be sweet to turn the clock back and see a return of those 80-100lb torpedoes that could conquer the Grand Canyon of the Elwha and spawn in the upper reaches, especially if I can watch them cruise by while I fish the Ranch section of the Elwha....
Steve

Wow, the 'big salmon' gene?! Yes, it would be amazing if they could find some of the Elwah big fish VGLL3! It might make some careful hatchery operations worth it!

I am curious - does VGLL3 play a role in triggering steelhead parr to smolt if their body fat isn't high enough to residualalize?
 

Ed Call

Long Lost Member
WFF Supporter
Thanks to those for sharing and getting us back on track. Informative as always. I'm not from Ca, nor do I plan to spend much time there. I can't help but think if fish can recover there they can recover many places more easily.
 

Yard Sale

Huge Member
I'm not from Ca, nor do I plan to spend much time there.

Don't do that. It would be like judging WFF by this thread. It's like thinking Washington is just Seattle and Oregon is just Portland.

Some of the most amazing country in the world is in California. Don't deny yourself a sunrise in Yosemite, a walk through the giant sequoias along the Eel, or a chance at a west coast sea run brown.

Related: I read page 7 and page 1 of the thread.
 

Tracker

Active Member
Don't do that. It would be like judging WFF by this thread. It's like thinking Washington is just Seattle and Oregon is just Portland.

Some of the most amazing country in the world is in California. Don't deny yourself a sunrise in Yosemite, a walk through the giant sequoias along the Eel, or a chance at a west coast sea run brown.

Related: I read page 7 and page 1 of the thread.

Well said. I've lived in some absolutely spectacular country from Alaska to Montana with California in between. The California coast and country in the Northern mountains is incredible. No State is absent of ass hats and all have politics both good and bad.
 

Steve Saville

WFF Supporter
I have lived in Southern California, for three years. I moved back to Washington about 35+ years ago to get away from the traffic only.

But...that really has nothing to do with the thread and I'm surprised, maybe, that it has gotten as far off topic as possible. The fact that there is a scientist that has taken the initiative to attempt to do something innovative in relation to salmon recovery is pretty impressive, considering what has or hasn't been done in the past. Perhaps if science is taken in this direction, salmon recovery might succeed to a degree where rivers that can no longer support native fish can have healthy runs of genetically diverse hatchery fish.

We know that interbreeding of all species dilutes the gene pool. This seems to me, though I am not a scientist, as a hopeful solution for the future of salmon runs. Let's try to stay on the topic, as has been suggested several times before. Name calling and body slamming aren't why I view this forum.
 

Swimmy

Practice your craft.
WFF Supporter
This thread
roll.gif
 

jwg

Active Member
If you look at the population of cali nothing Totez said is wrong. You can't argue othewise. This looks like head hunting. He liked and I assume agreed with original post. If you don't agree a large population in cali is mostly asswipes you have more faith in humanity then me....
I don't agree.
J
 

Ed Call

Long Lost Member
WFF Supporter
Don't do that. It would be like judging WFF by this thread. It's like thinking Washington is just Seattle and Oregon is just Portland.

Some of the most amazing country in the world is in California. Don't deny yourself a sunrise in Yosemite, a walk through the giant sequoias along the Eel, or a chance at a west coast sea run brown.

Related: I read page 7 and page 1 of the thread.
Great points, I exaggerate. I do plan on some high sierra and national park visits. No major metropolitan interest in CA for me.
 

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