Ethical question

wadin' boot

Donny, you're out of your element...
#1
You are fishing a SRC beach that typically hosts SRC. Resident coho are mixed in, meaning they are hitting the exact same flies. The fish are holding in the same areas, and unlike your standard resident coho-rt, they are sticking around. Fishing for coho is closed. The coho are Jack size like 16-18 inches, same size as the cutts, both are hammering poppers and subsurface. What do you do?
 

GAT

Dumbfounded
#2
That's a good one. You can not legally fish for coho but you can SRC... so, who's to say that you're fishing for coho if one jumps on your fly when you're trying to catch SRC?

If you plan to release the SRC and must release the coho, if you're using barbless hooks and releasing the fish PDQ, I can't see what harm it would do to go ahead and fish. Is it ethical? Beats me. Fyfishing itself as a sport may be unethical... Just depends on how you wish to define the word.
 

Dipnet

The wanted posters say Tim Hartman
#3
Boot, your question applied to ethics, not legality. According to the dictionary, ethics is defined as

"ˈeTHiks/
noun 1. moral principles that govern a person's behavior or the conducting of an activity."


So your question addresses what would any individual do in this situation according to his/her own moral principles.

Do you leave for another spot because you respect the state's decision to protect coho in this area? Do you leave because you personally have a concern for protection of this particular stock? Do you leave because you're afraid of getting ticketed by a warden? (That'd be a tough case to prove)

OTOH, do you continue to fish because you're targeting SRC and not coho, even though the catch is mixed? Do you still fish because you don't understand or agree with the reason for the coho closure? Do you continue to fish because you think the regulations are a bag of sh**?

It's obviously a personal decision and personally, I'd probably continue to fish as long as I was catching SRC in addition to the closed silvers. If the catch rate tipped more toward the coho and I knew there was a problem with those fish, I'd be probably leave for another beach/area.

I'm sure most of us are adept at catch-and-release but that still has an impact on the fish, regardless of how careful we are. If I was getting fish after fish of a highly threatened or endangered stock, I'd certainly quickly call it a day and either move to another spot or go home and mow the lawn.

But to reiterate, it would be up to each anglers conscience as to what to do.

YMMV!
 
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jasmillo

Active Member
#4
I have encountered this a few times and have kept fishing if SRC are mixed in. What I don’t do is cast to obvious (jumping/slashing) coho. There were a couple of times last summer where I came accross 2-3 lb coho mixed in w/ SRC. Good fish slashing bait and although it was difficult, I refrained from casting to them because the season was not open. For the most part I was able to keep them off the fly.

It’s a tough call though. I always treat the situation like I did when I used to fish rivers in MT that were open for everything but bull trout as an example. If I hook and land one, it was incidental. I consider that fine as long as you are not targeting them specifically.

Edit: and I agree with you @Dipnet. I think this is a moral question versus legal one....
 

Lymitliss

Active Member
#5
Friedrich Nietzsche was once quoted saying- "Morality is just a fiction used by the herd of inferior human beings to hold back the few superior men."

Not saying I live by this, but it's an interesting quote nevertheless. I'd keep fishing. :D
 

Dipnet

The wanted posters say Tim Hartman
#7
Friedrich Nietzsche was once quoted saying- "Morality is just a fiction used by the herd of inferior human beings to hold back the few superior men."
Yeah, this philosophy of his morphed into both Nazism and Fascism. Not the greatest of human ideals and I'm sure you can tell I'm not a fan of Nietzsche.
 

Lymitliss

Active Member
#8
Yeah, this philosophy of his morphed into both Nazism and Fascism. Not the greatest of human ideals and I'm sure you can tell I'm not a fan of Nietzsche.
I can understand that, but for the sake of keeping the conversation light hearted, we're only talking fish here. :D What I'm getting at is, I wouldn't worry about it if its catch and release.
 

Salmo_g

Well-Known Member
#11
My initial thought is like Chris'. If the coho are ad clipped, indicating hatchery fish, I wouldn't worry about it while targeting and catching SRC. If I kept hooking unmarked coho, I'd probably stop fishing or move to another location.
 
#12
I can understand that, but for the sake of keeping the conversation light hearted, we're only talking fish here. :D What I'm getting at is, I wouldn't worry about it if its catch and release.
yeah if have the goal of keeping the conversation light-hearted, you might not want to post such a heavy quote alluding to a mindset and belief system that fueled some super bad stuff. It also has nothing to do with fish and doesn't even really apply to the moral dilemma at hand.
 

XP

Active Member
#13
Personally, I always feel guilty when I start slaying fish cast after cast. It's fun for a bit but when you consider C&R mortality its doing real damage. If I get multiple steelhead out of a hole I usually move on or quit fishing. Same deal for searuns.

I show no mercy on stocker trout at bass though.
 

dflett68

Active Member
#14
Yeah, this philosophy of his morphed into both Nazism and Fascism. Not the greatest of human ideals and I'm sure you can tell I'm not a fan of Nietzsche.
the converse approach has been very useful for conditioning populations more than willing to follow a fascist leader. just a counter-point, not saying your point is completely false. just, balance.
 

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