NFR 2020 College Football

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landlocked

Active Member
Reading things like this makes it hard to understand how the players can't negotiate their compensation.

Go sox,
cds
I understand the conundrum on this with many. But, I still see tuition, room, board (specialty chefs, training tables with complete nutrition programs), tutors at no charge and always available, all the bling in the workout areas, as a big part of the equation. Its about 30k a year expense to a state school? Hell even back when I went, I had to work 2 jobs at night and weekends, plus summers in AK to get myself through financially. I can see giving the players 1k a month spending money, while at school and in decent academic standing, plus all the other perks they get, but past that...you've lost me. Hell, they lost me when coach salaries went past 3-million about 12 years ago on that side. Still funner to watch than NFL in my opinion.
 

Sportsman

Active Member
While I believe the players should get some extra compensation, your opening Pandora's box. Title IX will assure women's badminton players will get the same. And they deserve it, just as much as football players. Where does the money come from??
 

Charles Sullivan

Active Member
I understand the conundrum on this with many. But, I still see tuition, room, board (specialty chefs, training tables with complete nutrition programs), tutors at no charge and always available, all the bling in the workout areas, as a big part of the equation. Its about 30k a year expense to a state school? Hell even back when I went, I had to work 2 jobs at night and weekends, plus summers in AK to get myself through financially. I can see giving the players 1k a month spending money, while at school and in decent academic standing, plus all the other perks they get, but past that...you've lost me. Hell, they lost me when coach salaries went past 3-million about 12 years ago on that side. Still funner to watch than NFL in my opinion.
I can see them negotiating their salary either individually or collectively. It's how free markets work for everyone else. The coaches get to do this. Why can't the other laborers?

The product is great. I sometimes have a hard time enjoying it knowing that a cabal is keeping labor from negotiating their compensation. Having compensation dictated to you by a cabal is far different from negotiating compensation either individually or collectively.

Go Sox,
cds
 

Stonefish

Triploid, Humpy & Seaplane Hater....Know Grizzler
I can see them negotiating their salary either individually or collectively. It's how free markets work for everyone else. The coaches get to do this. Why can't the other laborers?

The product is great. I sometimes have a hard time enjoying it knowing that a cabal is keeping labor from negotiating their compensation. Having compensation dictated to you by a cabal is far different from negotiating compensation either individually or collectively.

Go Sox,
cds

I’ve said it before, but nobody makes a kid accept a scholarship. They know full well going on what they’ll receive in turn for their labors.
That is the system and it’s been that way for a long time. Maybe it will change, maybe not.
I’m really not sure.

I’ve also mentioned in the past that hopefully in the future, there will be a minor leagues for the NFL which kids can go directly to that have no intentions of getting a education.
I’m hoping the XFL now that Dwayne Johnson owns it will provide that opportunity in the future.
SF
 

Charles Sullivan

Active Member
I’ve said it before, but nobody makes a kid accept a scholarship. They know full well going on what they’ll receive in turn for their labors.
That is the system and it’s been that way for a long time. Maybe it will change, maybe not.
I’m really not sure.

I’ve also mentioned in the past that hopefully in the future, there will be a minor leagues for the NFL which kids can go directly to that have no intentions of getting a education.
I’m hoping the XFL now that Dwayne Johnson owns it will provide that opportunity in the future.
SF
There is a world of difference between having a choice and being able to negotiate. The fact that there have never been successful minor leagues shows the monopoly that the ncaa has become in football.
I'm not asking that the athletes/ labor receive cash. I am saying that not being able to negotiate their compensation is proof of a monopoly on its own. It is a basic right to negotiate your compensation either individually or collectively.

It would be great in my opinion for D1 athletes to negotiate collectively. The schools would be forced to open their books up to the light of scrutiny. I believe it would be quite illuminating. It is the last thing the NCAA wants and the power 5 conferences want. I suspect it is the last thing that addicted fans want. It would be great for the world to see though.

The present system is exploitive in that it eliminates a basic right of American free market enterprise; the right to negotiate compensation individually or collectively.

Why is that something we are afraid of? Why is it that the idea that these athletes would be treated equally to every other American when negotiating compensation so scary to so many? I think if we think in these terms the reason become obvious to those who are willing to be honest and challenge a tradition created for the benefit of a few.

Go Sox,
cds
 

Stonefish

Triploid, Humpy & Seaplane Hater....Know Grizzler
Maybe another option is to just eliminate scholarships as many folks seem to underestimate the value of them and the benefits they provide.
Athletes could then negotiate their pay for play and pay for their own education, housing, books, meals etc just like the general student population does.

As far as knowing what schools make in their athletic budgets or football programs if it is a public university, that wouldn’t be very difficult to find out. Just submit a public records request.
There is already a lot of information regarding finances out there so it isn’t like university athletic departments are trying to hide it.
SF
 
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Charles Sullivan

Active Member
Maybe another option is to just eliminate scholarships as many folks seem to underestimate the value of them and the benefits they provide.
Athletes could then negotiate their pay for play and pay for their own education, housing, books, meals etc just like the general student population does.

As far as knowing what schools make in their athletic budgets or football programs if it is a public university that wouldn’t be very difficult to find out. Just submit a public records request.
There is already a lot information regarding finances out there so it isn’t like university athletic departments are trying to hide it.
SF
I think that's a great idea! Negotiate individually! Treat professional college football players like the Americans that they are. Scholarships could be negotiated as compensation or not. It's really just an accounting exercise at some point. Hell, a kid could negotiate a lifelong scholarship if he was talented enough.

Now the swimmers and the wrestlers might not like that since they make no money for anyone but the football player who has creates revenue may get to actually reap the financial rewards of his talent rather than subsidizing the "non-revenue sports". For this reason, collective bargaining would get super interesting as the athletes would see how the money actually flows in D-1 athletic departments.

The professional college football player could also have direct access to the the boosters in the way legacy Harvard students do to the elites of the professions that they are at school to prepare for. Without the sham of amateurism in the way, he could more easily lay a path forward for after football through this access. Most don't play pro football after college. Imagine how mush a guaranteed job with a booster after school is done would help many kids out. They could negotiate that. They could even study for it. At present that would be an NCAA violation.

Free market enterprise for talented people. It's a concept that Americans generally favor......except for a certain group of talented people. hhhhmmmmmmm...........

Go Sox,
cds
 

creekx

Director of Stoke
I think that's a great idea! Negotiate individually! Treat professional college football players like the Americans that they are. Scholarships could be negotiated as compensation or not. It's really just an accounting exercise at some point. Hell, a kid could negotiate a lifelong scholarship if he was talented enough.

Now the swimmers and the wrestlers might not like that since they make no money for anyone but the football player who has creates revenue may get to actually reap the financial rewards of his talent rather than subsidizing the "non-revenue sports". For this reason, collective bargaining would get super interesting as the athletes would see how the money actually flows in D-1 athletic departments.

The professional college football player could also have direct access to the the boosters in the way legacy Harvard students do to the elites of the professions that they are at school to prepare for. Without the sham of amateurism in the way, he could more easily lay a path forward for after football through this access. Most don't play pro football after college. Imagine how mush a guaranteed job with a booster after school is done would help many kids out. They could negotiate that. They could even study for it. At present that would be an NCAA violation.

Free market enterprise for talented people. It's a concept that Americans generally favor......except for a certain group of talented people. hhhhmmmmmmm...........

Go Sox,
cds
Can't wait for the Title IX lawsuits when the women's badminton players demand the same pay as the star QB. I'll make popcorn...
 

Charles Sullivan

Active Member
Can't wait for the Title IX lawsuits when the women's badminton players demand the same pay as the star QB. I'll make popcorn...
I guess that I see that as the biggest positive. The idea that NCAA football is in any way similar to the other sports, basketball excepted, is silly. At this point the pro athletes are funding all the other amateur athletes who make no money for the Uni. Tying pro football to universities makes about as much sense as tying a reality TV show to a university.

Now, the athletes could negotiate collectively. In that case, the books are open and at some point the poor kids in revenue generating sports are gonna question why they are funding the prep school athletes in financial loser sports like wrestling and field hockey. That would be super interesting. Truthfully, it's something they should already be asking. The fact that there is 4 years of eligibility is really what holds this all back from happening.

The reason why football players can not negotiate their compensation is that it blows up the farce that "amateur" college football has become. I know that, everyone knows that. We all love to watch the college football. However, school/ state pride and the entertainment factor does not make a monopoly dictating compensation to players any more ethical. It does not make the ethnically and socioeconomically diverse revenue generating sports funding the preppy white kid sports any more ethical. It's become a quagmire where coaches make millions upon millions and the talent is robbed of basic labor basic rights by a monopoly. All the while state and school pride is used to cloud the judgement of us poor schleps who love the product. It's not gonna get better either. More money = more injustice in this case.

I can't decide if College football is an affront to American free market enterprise and labor law or really just the perfection of it.

Go Sox,
cds
 

landlocked

Active Member
Where does the money come from??
Thats a legit question, especially for schools who's athletic departments have been hammered by 2020's financial setbacks, and who don't have huge bank accounts to absorb the sting. Obviously Texas had some cash to spare.
 
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