Some Myths about Catch and Release

gt

Active Member
First, posting this on the internet literally communicates to others that the rules don't matter, that they can simply excuse the action because the fish is bleeding. You just gave them an excuse to also be a poacher. And yes, you did admit to being a poacher.

Next, a fish that is bleeding does not mean that it will die. This has been proven, time and time again. So your ultimate argument is moot.

If the fish does die, which they will do regardless of how careful we are, the fish is not wasted by being returned to the water. All sorts of critters that are ultimately beneficial to the environment will gladly make a meal out of it.

You literally have no idea where that fish is heading. You claim that it is an "unclipped" fish, but you don't know that, you just suspect that it is. It could also be from a truly depleted stock of fish that is just holding on. Not cool man.

Oh, and I already mentioned this, but it also makes you a poacher. You ok with that label?

sure i could have released that bleeding coho and maybe it could have avoided that 'cute' beady eyed 800# sea lion following along looking for an easy meal. better in my mind to harvest a fish not knowing if it would survive. call me a conservationist, poacher does not stick in this case. and since i am not into 'research' so see if the fish would belly up, the sea lion would have an easy meal or it would survive, i choose instead to have several great dinners. would i repeat?? sure thing, any bleeding fish in my mind, does not stand a great chance of survival.
 

Irafly

Indi Ira
WFF Supporter
sure i could have released that bleeding coho and maybe it could have avoided that 'cute' beady eyed 800# sea lion following along looking for an easy meal. better in my mind to harvest a fish not knowing if it would survive. call me a conservationist, poacher does not stick in this case. and since i am not into 'research' so see if the fish would belly up, the sea lion would have an easy meal or it would survive, i choose instead to have several great dinners. would i repeat?? sure thing, any bleeding fish in my mind, does not stand a great chance of survival.


Ok Poacher.
 

Irafly

Indi Ira
WFF Supporter
If we eliminated cameras and phones we would save a lot of fish ......... social media may be the biggest issue they face ........

I'd like to believe this, but I think the issue has been around for longer than the camera and social media. The term, "Picture or it didn't happen.", predates the internet. Photos have likely saved many fishes lives.
 

MGTom

Living at the place of many waters
WFF Supporter
I think c&r works, and I am always looking to get better. I've broken two rivers into 3/4 mi long stretches and rotate between them every couple weeks. I've seen the fish I've caught and photoed before living and feeding and even caught a couple again although usually I chase the ones I didn't get. I don't think the places like the Yakima River or Basin Lakes would last long if most of us wen't doing well with this.
 

Rob Allen

Active Member
From all the studies I have seen fish that die as a result of catch and release do so primarily from blood loss due to hook related injuries.
 

SinglehandJay

Misanthropist
sure i could have released that bleeding coho and maybe it could have avoided that 'cute' beady eyed 800# sea lion following along looking for an easy meal. better in my mind to harvest a fish not knowing if it would survive. call me a conservationist, poacher does not stick in this case. and since i am not into 'research' so see if the fish would belly up, the sea lion would have an easy meal or it would survive, i choose instead to have several great dinners. would i repeat?? sure thing, any bleeding fish in my mind, does not stand a great chance of survival.
You're a fucking idiot
 

silvercreek

Active Member
I think barbless hooks are a must

Hi Jamie,

Actually, that is a myth. I also used to believe that barbless hooks preserved trout population.

I suspect you have taken this myth at face value, without ever questioning it because it sounds so logical. Of course barbless hooks should be mandatory to preserve trout fisheries. I suspect you never questioned this or even asked a fisheries biologist about the research proving that barbless hooks preserved trout populations. Certainly, there must be abundant evidence and studies if this is true!

Actually the opposite is true.

There is abundant evidence that the mortality difference in Catch and Release fisheries between catching a fish with a barbless hook vs a barbed hook has no effect on fish population. This has been shown to be true not only in trout but other freshwater species and in saltwater C & R fisheries.

This is a previous thread that covers two contentious issues - the use of stomach pumps and barbed vs barbless hooks.


The mortality issue boils down to the scientific fact that in fisheries with good natural reproduction, the population of trout is determined by the carrying capacity of the river system. Natural mortality in these river systems commonly range from 30% to 65% each year. For lures and flies, the aggregate mean hooking mortality in multiple studies is 4.5% for barbed and 4.2% for barbless. This 0.3% difference makes no difference in the fish population when compared with the natural mortality of 30% to 65% each year.
 

Dr. Magill

Active Member
@silvercreek my evidence is purely anecdotal. I fish with all barbless. In the rare instance I fish with a barb I find it extremely difficult to release the fish. I like it when the hook just comes out once tension is gone. I also like them as they are easier to remove from my hat, head, rain coat, etc.
 

wetswinger

Active Member
@silvercreek my evidence is purely anecdotal. I fish with all barbless. In the rare instance I fish with a barb I find it extremely difficult to release the fish. I like it when the hook just comes out once tension is gone. I also like them as they are easier to remove from my hat, head, rain coat, etc.
I totally agree. I landed 4 little shakers yesterday and the hook fell out in the net without me even having to touch them.
 

gt

Active Member
From all the studies I have seen fish that die as a result of catch and release do so primarily from blood loss due to hook related injuries.

we have a community of people who don't believe in data. just check out the covid death rates. maskless idiots...
 

Irafly

Indi Ira
WFF Supporter
Hi Jamie,

Actually, that is a myth. I also used to believe that barbless hooks preserved trout population.

I suspect you have taken this myth at face value, without ever questioning it because it sounds so logical. Of course barbless hooks should be mandatory to preserve trout fisheries. I suspect you never questioned this or even asked a fisheries biologist about the research proving that barbless hooks preserved trout populations. Certainly, there must be abundant evidence and studies if this is true!

Actually the opposite is true.

There is abundant evidence that the mortality difference in Catch and Release fisheries between catching a fish with a barbless hook vs a barbed hook has no effect on fish population. This has been shown to be true not only in trout but other freshwater species and in saltwater C & R fisheries.

This is a previous thread that covers two contentious issues - the use of stomach pumps and barbed vs barbless hooks.


The mortality issue boils down to the scientific fact that in fisheries with good natural reproduction, the population of trout is determined by the carrying capacity of the river system. Natural mortality in these river systems commonly range from 30% to 65% each year. For lures and flies, the aggregate mean hooking mortality in multiple studies is 4.5% for barbed and 4.2% for barbless. This 0.3% difference makes no difference in the fish population when compared with the natural mortality of 30% to 65% each year.
These studies are for fisheries with self sustaining population, not for things like lakes with a non sustaining population. We are also looking at mortality versus overall population of a fishery.
 
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Mike.Cline

Bozeman, Montana
Today was just an average morning on the river. 21 fish in 4.5 hours. All were released and they ranged in size from 10” to 18”. Four species—Cutt, Bow, Brown and Whitefish. They came from a river with excellent water quality, strong biomass and fish density at the upper limit of capacity. If the biologists are correct that at least 1 in 5 trout (20%) die off (all manners of mortality) every season, then 4 of the fish I caught will be statistically dead next season. If C&R mortality is 3-5%, then at least one of those fish is statistically dead.

I’ve had 100+ fish days on several SW Montana rivers in the last decade and 50+ days have not been uncommon. I like to fish and I am good at it. If I worried about the statistics it wouldn’t be fun anymore.

Our education and energy needs to focus on maintaining healthy watersheds with strong diverse biomass. Living things die, so fish mortality is just part of the cycle.

Today it was hoppers, Humpys and streamers on barbless hooks that did them in. They are “killing” flies in August as the English would say!
 

Tristan Mikoleit

WFF Supporter
On the barbless front, I haven't researched mortality rates, but I do know that no matter how cool it sounds that I hate ripping the lips of a trout. The last couple years all my tied flies have been barbless, but whenever I do encounter an old fly and forget to pinch it, I regret it the first fish I catch.
 

Chris Bellows

Your Preferred WFF Poster
Ok Poacher.

No fan of gt, but anyone who fished the first few seasons of wild coho release remembers how difficult it was to find clipped fish. I had close to zero bleeders with casting flies, but saw tons of floaters released by those fishing gear, especially double hook rigs. Everyone who fished those years thought exactly how gt did. Many acted on those thoughts and as someone who experienced it I cannot get too moral against those who did... although changing gear types would have dramatically reduced bleeders and mortality, which most fishermen refused to do... so I guess I can get a bit moralistic ;)
 

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