IMHO - there is a problem with WFF

Buzzy

Active Member
Let's face it there are three reasons to post fish pics and locations.

1. You are stroking your ego and need validation from others.

2. You are a guide and therefore are stroking your own ego and letting folks know you get them because you are whoring out a resource.

3. You don't know any better and are excited cause you're new and you got one. Yes there's an innocent ego stroke there but you are salvageable and open to be educated.

Basically one and two are terrible humans and should be hunted on an island by @Dustin Bise and other form members for sadistic thrills and sport. The third should be steered and have their enthusiasm fostered by the good community that fly anglers generally are.
OW! OUCH! Good thing I'm thick skinned figuratively (not literally at 71 YO); I had no idea I was such a self serving ego stroker in need of so much validation! ;-)
 
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Clarkman

Huge Fly Guy
WFF Supporter
As much as I would like to take a shot at some muskies don't you ever Hotspot. :)
I would rather you keep catching and showing fish.

Been on a bit of a dry spell lately, a bit of a combo of poor timing (fish when ya can) and blowing a boatside eat a couple of weeks ago (I swear I waited for the turn, I swear...and I swore) after a stellar late Spring. This weekend though....it's gonna change, I can feel it. All it takes is one.
 

Jiminsandiego

Active Member
Interesting thread. I'd fished (sport and commercial) for a half a century before ever hearing the words "hot spotting" (before moving to Washington). In San Diego ( 3 million people) I would regularly make forum posts giving precise details down to the very rock (literally) and never heard the term. When money is involved things change. A drunk deckhand at the bar can cost a boat owner thousands. So I know the value of a tight lip. Commercially fishing, we routinely nicknamed reefs. For instance, San Mateo was renamed "Mt Whitney". This was very helpful for discussions conducted in public (the bar). Just some random input for reference, cheers
 
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Jiminsandiego

Active Member
Counter measures have also been addressed in this thread. Leading the "competition" in a false direction is something that I have often seen used ruthlessly. Offshore SoCal they often mark kelp patties with inflated plastic bags. Using these inflated bags, as a distraction, has become an art form.
 

jamma

Active Member
Hell’s bells I can’t believe some of you still believe that the problem people have with hot spotting is about giving away “secrets”. It’s not. There are no secret places. It’s about hot spotting = hype = increased pressure on a fishery where increased pressure can have a negative impact. And that negative impact can come in a variety of forms.
Correct me if I'm wrong, are you saying every fisher, but you, is out to screw-up the fishing and has no right to fish your "hot-spot"? I find find that a rather odd opinion to have on a website that is set up for the dissemination of information precisely of that nature. My view is that the people on this website are people who share the same passion and respect for fly fishing as I do. Is there some great conspiracy of "hole-wreckers" trolling websites for that sole purpose? Sounds like a pretty dubious life-goal to me. Help me understand, but I'm sure I do already.
 

KerryS

Ignored Member
Counter measures have also been addressed in this thread. Leading the "competition" in a false direction is something that I have often seen used ruthlessly. Offshore SoCal they often mark kelp patties with inflated plastic bags. Using these inflated bags, as a distraction, has become an art form.
I got raked over the proverbial coals on a different website for posting up about a large number of big fish holding by a bridge on a famous steelhead river. The next day I drove by and there were a half dozen or so guys (there almost always was a half dozen or so people fishing there) throwing store bought files on Kmart rods trying to catch those big fish. What I failed to include in my report was those big fish were white fish. LOL!
 

surfnfish

Active Member
buddy and I took a late fall trip up a coastal river that takes a lot of effort to get into from the bay it feeds, including dragging the boat over gravel beds and sand bars to get to prime water...and swung up some really nice fresh King's for our effort.
So my buddy took a pic of me holding one, posted it on Instagram, nothing behind me in the frame but a featureless bank that looks like a hundred others on a dozen coastal rivers....and got a PM from a friend of ours "don't ever post a picture of that river again'...this for a river that sleds run up, and a few dozen boats with access to a private ramp even troll on

some people just want the church all to themselves...
 

Chris Scoones

WFF Admin
WFF Supporter
Soon I'll merge this drivel into the original thread.

BTW, there isn't an issue with those posting fish pics. Those who feel one way or another towards it can continue to keep it to themselves. In this case the other threads OP was too stupid to recognize a compliment, and his resulting posts were over my line.
 
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Chris Scoones

WFF Admin
WFF Supporter
Randall, I'm down if the group wants another shot at him. Let me know and I'll turn his account back on. The intended result, however, should play with my sense of humor. If it's just extending a shit show, we can do without that.
 

Fast Action Freddie

Having a drink in The Buff
Correct me if I'm wrong, are you saying every fisher, but you, is out to screw-up the fishing and has no right to fish your "hot-spot"? I find find that a rather odd opinion to have on a website that is set up for the dissemination of information precisely of that nature. My view is that the people on this website are people who share the same passion and respect for fly fishing as I do. Is there some great conspiracy of "hole-wreckers" trolling websites for that sole purpose? Sounds like a pretty dubious life-goal to me. Help me understand, but I'm sure I do already.
Hmm. In all due respect, I didn’t say or imply anything even remotely close to any of that.
I didn’t say any fishers are “out to screw-up the fishing”. (They’re not)
I didn’t say anything about anyone not having right to fish anywhere. (They do - public lands)
I agree that the people on this website have passion and respect for fly fishing. (They do)
I also believe that the THOUSANDS non-members who come to this site for info also have a passion and respect for fly fishing. (They do too)
I don’t think there exists such a fly fisher who is a “whole-wrecker” - never seen or heard of a single piece of evidence of that. (I also don’t believe in conspiracies theories)
None of this has anything to do with any of that.
Let’s go back to what I did say:
hot spotting = hype = increased pressure on a fishery where increased pressure can have a negative impact.

Some fisheries can and do sustain large numbers of fishers converging at the same place (aka crowding aka pressure) with no negative impact to the fishery or the environment. Others not so much. The internet can be a real multiplier vs the old fashioned “word of mouth”. Even if the actual fish/fishery are not too adversely impacted (but they often are with pressure) do you enjoy fishing with crowds who have converged on the hot spot? Enjoy not finding a camp spot because they’re all taken? enjoy seeing the impact to the environment where people trample an area to create a camp spot where one doesn’t exist.

Think of it similar to the impact when hiking and backpacking in the NW became huge and mainstream a few to handful of decades ago. As the saying goes these places were being “loved to death” by those that had a passion and respect for these places. With large numbers of people there are ecological impacts, impacts to the environment and impacts the pristine natural setting. As such, permit systems came into place, some hikes removed from guidebooks for these places being “loved to death”. I wonder if Ira Spring ever looked back on his life’s work of hiking guide books and thought “ew, maybe that was too much info ... I had no idea that many people would converge” (hot spotting)

My other motivation is less noble and altruistic: self interest. Even if the place is not a secret, I don’t like fishing in conditions where there are more fishers than the fishery can support- e.g. just about every fishable hole taken or already pounded multiple times that day, every campsite taken. So yeah it’s selfish I guess - but we each want what we want from “the experience “ ... and I’ve seen how some of these “experiences” have changed pre-internet to the early internet days to now.
 

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