WDFW Looking at restrictions for steelhead season

flybill

A collector never stops collecting!
WFF Supporter
I don't want to argue about this but I think this us a bad idea..
1. It doesn't help the fish
2. It hurts people.

All laws that don't help the problem but hurt people is bad.

Predictions for this winter.

Fighting, tire slashing, and side planers
I agree Rob! I also thinks it hurts small businesses like guides out there. Changes need to be made, but shutting things down doesn't help and while I like the idea of not fishing from a boat it needs to be implemented differently imho.

No easy answers, but for me I won't be out on the OP this season. The Skagit / Sauk, yes. The Skykomish for sure! And a few other places, but you'll see me there if you see me!

Bill
 

Rob Allen

Active Member
You don't believe this will reduce the number of fish caught? If so, why?

I didn't say it wouldn't reduce the number of fish caught. I don't think reducing the number of fish caught will help the run in any way shape or form because the ocean is the limiting factor.

If only 450 fish spawn instead of 500. That will have no impact on the number of smolts produced nor will it impact future runs..
 

Jonathan Tachell

Active Member
These totals for the Hoh do not add up to the same numbers of the other graph presented earlier on this thread. At least one must be wrong.

The other graph is posted on page 18 of this thread and shows an average of about 0.4 steelhead caught an hour on the Hoh for all rec anglers. However, the graph here says that the combined rec angler success rate on the Hoh fluctuates from 0.7 steelhead an hour to 1.3 steelhead an hour depending on the month with an average of about 1.0 steelhead caught an hour.
 
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dustinchromers

Active Member
I third this motion. I did that for one season until I realized how fragile that part of the habitat is. I was hooking spawners in February and other fish that had obviously been caught a few times lower in the river. Those fish need a finish line, because right now they can get fucked with even when they fuckin'. I actually haven't been back to the OP since I think 2012?

I'm down to clown on some trout. Been gettin way more in to that the last few years. Detroit Lake stockers this last year was EPIC (before the fires, obviously)

The park shouldn't be having guides in it anyway. I always felt the park rivers were a good place to avoid mass traffic. If you're going to have a park it seems to be it should be a bit more commerce free with the exception of a few services. The park rivers have as many guides on them now as everywhere else. Closing the upper Hoh altogether would be fine with me. Spawning fish don't need the harassment and many practice zero restraint. "Right there, cast where that flagging is hanging."
 

GOTY

9x Puget Sound Steelhead Guide of the Year
These totals for the Hoh do not add up to the same numbers of the other graph presented earlier of boat anglers averaging around 1.3 steelhead caught an hour. At least one must be wrong.
I missed that graph showing a 1.3 catch rate per hour on the hoh, but I agree that seems off unless I'm in the boat.

I did post a WDFW graph earlier that broke it down by month, and it maxed out in April right around 1.0. Obviously though that has meaningful sample size issues since it is just a few years of data and then further breaking it down into a months, so it's only based on a small # of actual days. A single good day in that sample could easily distort the #s up, similar to skagit catch data where that one Wednesday a few years ago was absurd (plenty of double digit days for boats). Given the difference in time frames and methodology for recording (landed vs encounters, and potential reporting bias/issues), the two I posted seem plausibly consistent with one another. All of them are distorted a bit by a # of factors, but the data set in the second graph is robust enough to be usable. The Calawah for example is insanely inflated due to the reduced # of days on that river where it is floatable, causing many guides to only fish it when it's good and in shape....where as plenty of guides/sports will go to the hoh or bogie day after day regardless of conditions.
 

Gyrfalcon21

Honoring Vets
The bad news, to me, is that even if we had a somewhat healthy steelhead population right now, the new bro pack, instagram hero, youtube exploitation, new school guiding lot to make money would decimate the fish anyway. It is, was and will. Chamber of Commerces just want your money at all cost.

Changes were needed already and this is small, but a step maybe?
 
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Jonathan Tachell

Active Member
I missed that graph showing a 1.3 catch rate per hour on the hoh, but I agree that seems off unless I'm in the boat.

I did post a WDFW graph earlier that broke it down by month, and it maxed out in April right around 1.0. Obviously though that has meaningful sample size issues since it is just a few years of data and then further breaking it down into a months, so it's only based on a small # of actual days. A single good day in that sample could easily distort the #s up, similar to skagit catch data where that one Wednesday a few years ago was absurd (plenty of double digit days for boats). Given the difference in time frames and methodology for recording (landed vs encounters, and potential reporting bias/issues), the two I posted seem plausibly consistent with one another. All of them are distorted a bit by a # of factors, but the data set in the second graph is robust enough to be usable. The Calawah for example is insanely inflated due to the reduced # of days on that river where it is floatable, causing many guides to only fish it when it's good and in shape....where as plenty of guides/sports will go to the hoh or bogie day after day regardless of conditions.
I agree that there are many factors that can effect the data collected. However, decisions are made based on such data and when one set is over twice that of the other that is a large amount that can impact fisheries management in one direction or another.

Does anyone know if the WDFW and Quillayute's factor in the extremely poor water clarity that must make redd counts extremely difficult to impossible on the Bogachiel below the slide? A lot of winter steelhead spawn from the slide down to the lower river, especially from mid March on.
 

bk paige

Wishin I was on the Sauk
I agree that there are many factors that can effect the data collected. However, decisions are made based on such data and when one set is over twice that of the other that is a large amount that can impact fisheries management in one direction or another.

Does anyone know if the WDFW and Quillayute's factor in the extremely poor water clarity that must make redd counts extremely difficult to impossible on the Bogachiel below the slide? A lot of winter steelhead spawn from the slide down to the lower river, especially from mid March on.


From people I know that had done surveys for the tribes said the trible members told them were to mark reds, even if no red was evident.
 

Joepa

Joe from PA
Oh man, that’s gonna get ugly. Must see TV!
Surprisingly, it was a very civil meeting. Only a few bonehead comments (e.g. the doofus that chastised Larry Carpenter for not taking notes). Lots of comments in favor of the new regs and overwhelmingly in favor of conservation. I doubt these comments result in any changes.
 

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