Preferred hooks for smaller chironomids?

tkww

Member
I like daiichi 1150 14’s. Anyone know if it is the same wire for the Alec Jackson version?
I tried looking around and couldn't fine specific specs for the AJ hook. I'm under the impression the only difference compared to the 1150s is the finish. But I don't know that for a fact.

I have had good luck w/ the 1150s. Kinda wish it was 2xh in those smallest sizes, but the 1x is a nice compromise for keeping the fly body slim. I think the thing that really helps is the eye direction. My guess is that it leverages less than a straight or down eye. You can get them all the way down to 18s, which is pretty small since it's a short hook already.

You might consider Firehole's 637. Unfortunately it has a down eye, but it's 1x short, 2x gape and listed as extra-heavy wire. (Their weights are light (dry), medium, heavy, and extra-heavy, so this is their thickest wire.) Sizes all down to 22. I don't have a ton of experience with their hooks yet, but what I have tried hasn't had any obvious problems.
 

troutpocket

Active Member
I tried looking around and couldn't fine specific specs for the AJ hook. I'm under the impression the only difference compared to the 1150s is the finish. But I don't know that for a fact.

I have had good luck w/ the 1150s. Kinda wish it was 2xh in those smallest sizes, but the 1x is a nice compromise for keeping the fly body slim. I think the thing that really helps is the eye direction. My guess is that it leverages less than a straight or down eye. You can get them all the way down to 18s, which is pretty small since it's a short hook already.

You might consider Firehole's 637. Unfortunately it has a down eye, but it's 1x short, 2x gape and listed as extra-heavy wire. (Their weights are light (dry), medium, heavy, and extra-heavy, so this is their thickest wire.) Sizes all down to 22. I don't have a ton of experience with their hooks yet, but what I have tried hasn't had any obvious problems.
Firehole 637’s look good. Probably similar shank length to daiichi 1150 but it would be nice to see them up close. I also wish the 1150’s were a bit more stout but the 14’s haven’t let me down. I have bent out a few in size 10.

My experience with Alec Jackson covert nymph hooks has been good and the daiichi equivalent 1760 as well. I don’t want to go smaller than the 15’s I already have though because the gape gets pretty small.
 

long_rod_silvers

WFF Supporter
I am a big fan of Alec Jackson chironomid hooks! I believe Diachi manufactures to Alecs specs. Sharp and have always been consistent in quality. Size of hooks go down to a 17.




Or

Do the Hareline AJs (from Pacific link) have the crystal/covert finish? Intrigued by a "camo" hook.
 

tkww

Member
Firehole 637’s look good. Probably similar shank length to daiichi 1150 but it would be nice to see them up close. I also wish the 1150’s were a bit more stout but the 14’s haven’t let me down. I have bent out a few in size 10.
@troutpocket : not sure if you'll find these helpful. I don't have any 2488h in 18, so I compared them in 16.

I think Sean may be onto something. In thinking about it, I have used the 2488h (#16) and 2457 (18 and 20s) w/o straighting issues. Not the greatest hook-up ratio with the 2457s, but no strength issues. In retrospect I will probably pick up some 2488h's in smaller sizes. The 2499-SP are the better point (+BL) version of the 2488h. It's listed at 2xh, and in looking at them compared to the Daiichi 1150s, they do seem slightly heavier.

I think the kicker for any of them is how they hang in relation to the eye angle, and whether that leaves the point more outwards, or the fly cants slightly and the hook point moves in and more in line with the tippet. Particularly with loop knots.

But I would vote for the 2488h (or 2499) or the Firehole 637.

084-hook-comp-#16.jpg
084-hook-comp-#16-v2.jpg
 

troutpocket

Active Member
@troutpocket : not sure if you'll find these helpful. I don't have any 2488h in 18, so I compared them in 16.

I think Sean may be onto something. In thinking about it, I have used the 2488h (#16) and 2457 (18 and 20s) w/o straighting issues. Not the greatest hook-up ratio with the 2457s, but no strength issues. In retrospect I will probably pick up some 2488h's in smaller sizes. The 2499-SP are the better point (+BL) version of the 2488h. It's listed at 2xh, and in looking at them compared to the Daiichi 1150s, they do seem slightly heavier.

I think the kicker for any of them is how they hang in relation to the eye angle, and whether that leaves the point more outwards, or the fly cants slightly and the hook point moves in and more in line with the tippet. Particularly with loop knots.

But I would vote for the 2488h (or 2499) or the Firehole 637.

View attachment 265225
View attachment 265226
Thanks for the photos; I agree the TMC 2488h looks promising. I will try to get over to my local shop tomorrow and see what’s available. I haven’t been inside a fly shop since February.

TMC 2457 and Daiichi 1120’s are my go to hooks for micro leeches in size 10 and 12. I don’t care for them as chironomid hooks. It’s hard for me to get them skinny enough on that platform.
 

tkww

Member
Thanks for the photos; I agree the TMC 2488h looks promising. I will try to get over to my local shop tomorrow and see what’s available. I haven’t been inside a fly shop since February.

TMC 2457 and Daiichi 1120’s are my go to hooks for micro leeches in size 10 and 12. I don’t care for them as chironomid hooks. It’s hard for me to get them skinny enough on that platform.

Well, the 2488h is the same 2xh as the 2457, just w/ a straight eye. So you may not like them.
 

onefish

Active Member
The biggest, fattest, strongest hooks are not the best hooks for tying #16's and smaller IMO. It is a balancing act between tying a nice chronie that is on a hook that is strong enough most of the time. That is about the best you can do with the small flys if you want your flys to look realistic.
 
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tkww

Member
Those won't fish at all. I'll send my address so you can safely dispose of them.

Are the 15s basically a 16? Doesn't look like a huge difference compared to the 18s.
 

troutpocket

Active Member
Top Daiichi 1760 #14
Middle Alec Jackson covert #15
Bottom Hanak 250 BL #18
19C93B77-DD5B-40C5-AF19-0374D4BE9110.jpeg
There is a substantial difference between the Daiichi #14 and AJ #15. The AJ leans small. The Hanak #18 leans big, more like a #16, which is in line with the other Hanak hook I tried (Hanak 310 Buzzer #14 is comparable to TMC 2457 #12).
 
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Buzzy

Active Member
Top Daiichi 1760 #14
Middle Alec Jackson covert #15
Bottom Hanak 250 BL #18
View attachment 265680
There is a substantial difference between the Daiichi #14 and AJ #15. The AJ leans small. The Hanak #18 leans big, more like a #16, which is in line with the other Hanak hook I tried (Hanak 310 Buzzer #14 is comparable to TMC 2457 #12).
Great thread you've got going here Rod! And very interesting to see what the favorite midge hooks are for stillwater members. For a long time I tied midges on TMC 2457's - stout hook, you aren't going to straighten 'em and I always thought it was one of the better strike to hook up hooks. I've gotten away from the 2457 - I'm a fan of the AJ hooks and the Maruto c40HW's.

Really nice to see so many barbless hooks becoming available.
 
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Irafly

Indi Ira
WFF Supporter
I’ve watched @troutpocket have no issues with hooking fish on the AJ hooks, but I on the other hand struggle with them. They are eaten, but my lost fish on them are greater than his. I’ve preferred scud hooks for hook up ratio and these Hanaks look more my style.
 

troutpocket

Active Member
One more photo for reference. After Hollister scored the second TD for the hawks I poured another Jubelale and tied a couple on Dai Riki 135 #18’s. They feel much smaller than the Hanaks. The scud hook shape doesn’t work with my 2.0mm beads.
694747E3-4386-4BD5-B2CC-98CD7779FA02.jpeg
Being quite small and unweighted, I will give them a try casting to risers.
 

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