Question...is Euro nymphing actually fly fishing?

LilCutts

fish & whistle
Premium
I've heard arguments on both sides from guides and anglers on the east and west coasts. Some think it is, some think it isn't. Seems like a matter of opinion and where you draw the line on the definition of fly fishing. Thoughts?
 

Dustin Bise

reformed hot-spotter
And there in we get at the crux of the problem. Why make fly fishing bigger, let alone wayyy bigger, unless you're trying to make a buck by commercializing it? Fly fishing was a perfectly good small niche market until somebody decided they could make a lot more money by expanding the universe that fly fishing has become.
blame al gore, he invented the internet
 

DerekWhipple

Active Member
Page 16, under Definitions and Terms:
Fly Fishing Only In “Fly Fishing Only” waters, an- glers may use only the following gear: up to 2 flies, each with a barbless single-point hook, not to exceed 1⁄2" from point to shank, knotless nets, and conventional fly line or a conventional “Tenkara” fly line. Other line can be used for backing or leader if attached to conventional “Tenkara” fly line or at least 25 feet of conventional fly line. Anglers may not use: fixed spool reels, bait, or weights.

It seems to be written to exclude a euro nymph line while careful to include Tenkara fly line. A euro nymph line might not be a ”conventional fly line” since its weight isn’t involved in the cast. I think there are fishers that fish chironomids on fly fishing only lakes with a long straight mono leader and an indicator, and they get away with it by tying the mono to a conventional line, although they might not use the line to cast it.
A euro nymph line is a conventional fly line. That is the whole point of it. It is putting a conventional fly line that is as thin as possible on your reel to stay legal. Otherwise you would just use 30 feet of mono and call it a day. Anglers in Europe who aren't following FIPS regulations have no problem spooling up the whole reel with mono.

The funny thing with people who don't regard it as "real" fly fishing (not you, Paul) is that this whole style (excluding actual Czech/Polish nymphing) was developed within the confines of a set of rules to make sure people were still "fly fishing". A fly line no less than 0.022" must be used, no indicator can be used, leader cannot be more than 2x the length of your rod, dropper flies cannot be tied on the bend of the hook. There are other rules I am forgetting. Anglers who are following FIPS regulations are using a stricter definition of fly fishing than most anglers in "fly-fishing only" waters. There are methods allowed in "fly-fishing only" waters that would not be allowed in a FIPS competition.

If Washington or Oregon regulations were written to specifically exclude French or Spanish-style (competition) nymphing it would be incredibly obvious and ridiculous. If you started talking about regulating the use of a fly line, then fishing a conventional fly fishing style with just the leader out the rod tip would arguably be illegal. Besides, I think it is too popular for them to ban it.
 

jaredoconnor

Premium
Page 16, under Definitions and Terms:
Fly Fishing Only In “Fly Fishing Only” waters, an- glers may use only the following gear: up to 2 flies, each with a barbless single-point hook, not to exceed 1⁄2" from point to shank, knotless nets, and conventional fly line or a conventional “Tenkara” fly line. Other line can be used for backing or leader if attached to conventional “Tenkara” fly line or at least 25 feet of conventional fly line. Anglers may not use: fixed spool reels, bait, or weights.

It seems to be written to exclude a euro nymph line while careful to include Tenkara fly line. A euro nymph line might not be a ”conventional fly line” since its weight isn’t involved in the cast. I think there are fishers that fish chironomids on fly fishing only lakes with a long straight mono leader and an indicator, and they get away with it by tying the mono to a conventional line, although they might not use the line to cast it.

It sounds tenuous to me, to assume that "conventional fly line" wouldn't include a euro nymphing line.

In any case, I don't use euro nymphing lines; I use a 30 foot leader, which is attached to a 4wt line. The 4wt line never comes off my reel, but it is there if I want to put a normal leader on. It sounds like my setup, despite not being FIPS legal, meets the regulations.

Interestingly, the regulations say you "may only use the following gear" and makes no mention of strike indicators. Thus, it sound like strike indicators are not allowed.

Maybe the title of this thread should be more like...
"Is using strike indicators and/or split shot actually fly fishing?"

:p
 
Last edited:

Paul Huffman

Driven by irrational exuberance.
A euro nymph line is a conventional fly line. That is the whole point of it. It is putting a conventional fly line that is as thin as possible on your reel to stay legal. Otherwise you would just use 30 feet of mono and call it a day. Anglers in Europe who aren't following FIPS regulations have no problem spooling up the whole reel with mono.

The funny thing with people who don't regard it as "real" fly fishing (not you, Paul) is that this whole style (excluding actual Czech/Polish nymphing) was developed within the confines of a set of rules to make sure people were still "fly fishing". A fly line no less than 0.022" must be used, no indicator can be used, leader cannot be more than 2x the length of your rod, dropper flies cannot be tied on the bend of the hook. There are other rules I am forgetting. Anglers who are following FIPS regulations are using a stricter definition of fly fishing than most anglers in "fly-fishing only" waters. There are methods allowed in "fly-fishing only" waters that would not be allowed in a FIPS competition.

If Washington or Oregon regulations were written to specifically exclude French or Spanish-style (competition) nymphing it would be incredibly obvious and ridiculous. If you started talking about regulating the use of a fly line, then fishing a conventional fly fishing style with just the leader out the rod tip would arguably be illegal. Besides, I think it is too popular for them to ban it.
Sometimes I wonder why use a euro fly line at all. Why not tie the sighter leader to a section of Wonder Braid, or just mono. I don’t have to cast very far usually but it‘s the loop on the euro line, now replaced by a small nail knot, catching a guide, or just the slack in the euro line slapping up against the rod that limits longer casts. It seems like mono all the way would suffice for Selective Gear Rules.
 

Dustin Bise

reformed hot-spotter
Sometimes I wonder why use a euro fly line at all. Why not tie the sighter leader to a section of Wonder Braid, or just mono. I don’t have to cast very far usually but it‘s the loop on the euro line, now replaced by a small nail knot, catching a guide, or just the slack in the euro line slapping up against the rod that limits longer casts. It seems like mono all the way would suffice for Selective Gear Rules.
selective gear, and fly fishing only, are separate rulesets.
 

Salmo_g

Premium
If Euro nymphing was actually fly fishing, it would be called fly fishing and not Euro nymphing. I can't believe this is going on for 16 pages. Besides, I checked with Rob Allen about Euro nymphing, you know, the binary guy who sees things in black and white. He said Euro nymping isn't fly fishing. Really now, that should settle the matter, once and for all.
 

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