Does tradition matter while steelheading

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#61
Chad it is maybe in my head but I have caught fish on nymphs and also swinging. I think you can feel when you have moved a fish in winter cause your flies get absolutely slammed. Not to say it never happens in nymphing but usually the takes are so slight, hence the bobber to help detect them. For me the take is king an I like swinging takes. The majority of them are just more exciting to me than watching a bobber bounce up and down.

Also in the summer when fishing floating lines with skating or just below surface flies you are always moving fish. Not many steelhead I know of hang out in the top 2 inches of the water column.

-sean
 

alpinetrout

Banned or Parked
#62
I suppose Backyard and I had it coming a few months back when a group of guys swinging flies with spey rods blatantly low-holed us while we were nymphing our way through water that didn't even lend itself to swung flies, right? Ironically, the only steelhead I hooked that day was on a swung fly, but I probably lost it as payback for my blasphemy earlier in the day, right? Tradition means nothing, ethics mean everything.
 

inland

Active Member
#63
Jason, Chad, et all-

"Does that mean 'nymphers' aren't being legal? No. Does that mean 'nymphers aren't being ethical? No. Does that mean 'nymphers' aren't having fun? No. Does it mean 'nymphers' aren't really flyfishing? No. That is up to the individual."

What part of that did you skip?

William
 
#64
sean said:
That is the challenge and what I enjoy doing. And Mr. Baker your first point illustrates how little you know about swinging. Misunderstanding on both sides it what propogates all this rhetoric.

As usual this thread comes up again and again and I do not think the posters main initiative was to attack nymphers. You guys are just too sensitive. It really does not matter. What does is we have a connection with the folks who came before us and owe alot of our sport to them and thier innovations. It is lame to say well they killed all our fish and discredit it all. Being flippant and dismissive does not help anything. Neither does people harrasing you for how you fish on the river. I choose to swing flies but if I saw that happening to anyone out there fishing how they chose the offender would be getting a 16'1" colonoscopy.

I feel being cognitive of the past with an eye towards the future is the best way to live life in general, not just fishing.

-sean

My first point was "You are a usual suspect." Point #2 referred to spin fishing. Read before commenting....
 
#65
I suppose Backyard and I had it coming a few months back when a group of guys swinging flies with spey rods blatantly low-holed us while we were nymphing our way through water that didn't even lend itself to swung flies, right? Ironically, the only steelhead I hooked that day was on a swung fly, but I probably lost it as payback for my blasphemy earlier in the day, right? Tradition means nothing, ethics mean everything.
Tradition says not to low hole some one. Ethics comes into play on whether or not you decide to respect that tradition. They are both intertwined.

-sean

ps I hope you gave those guys a piece of your mind.
 
#66
Not that it really matters which came first, but for the record people have been fishing spoons and spinner-like lures for salmon for hundreds of years in Europe. Patents on many of the french-style spinners used today (i.e. mepps) go back to the early and mid 19th century. I've even seen several hundred year old american indian hand-line hooks that were made to look like fish, a crude yet ancient form of a lure. I can't remember the Zane Grey story name but I remember reading one of his earliest stories about him fishing spinners in the 20's at a logging camp for steelhead in a brawling river I think it was in Washington. That would have been about 50 years before 2-handed rod even began to become slightly popular for steelhead and salmon fishing. I would be willing to bet that spoons and spinners were used extensively fishing for steelhead in the pacific northwest long before a fly angling tradition was established - back in those days people had to put food on the table and didn't have the luxury to sit around and think about what kind of fishing they did.

The greatest irony is that that many of those 16-18 foot greenheart rods on the Spey and Dee were used with older forms of lures as well as flies, and also were used extensively to fish bait:eek: .
 

inland

Active Member
#67
Chad,

Since you like playing devils advocate...what is your definition of flyfishing? In the couple of years I have been reading this board I don't recall one time that you have given anything more than counterpoint,with intent to dispell, to anybody that gives a personal opinion of what constitutes flyfishing to them.

William
 

chadk

Be the guide...
#69
inland said:
Allright John,

What came to prominance first? The swinging wet fly or swinging spinner/spoon? Who copied who?

William

Sounds like a chicken and egg situation. Or a duck and egg in this case :hmmm:
 

inland

Active Member
#70
John,

Where does the swung wet fly history fall into line with 'spinners' and 'spoons', not imitative lures, considering Berners? And that she was predated by the Chinese by a long time?

Just curious.

William
 

chadk

Be the guide...
#73
Fred,

All I'm saying is that if it looks like a duck, swings like a duck, presents like a duck, attracts like a duck, get's a response like a duck, it must be a duck. I'm using your logic. Does it matter who did it first or who coppied who?

You can call it fly fishing if you want, but for now on, when I see someone swinging - especially with a spey rod, I'm going to think about ducks and spoons I'm afraid.

;)

(I'm really not taking this too seriously if you can't tell - just pointing out that your duck logic is kinda silly)
 
#74
inland said:
Jason, Chad, et all-

"Does that mean 'nymphers' aren't being legal? No. Does that mean 'nymphers aren't being ethical? No. Does that mean 'nymphers' aren't having fun? No. Does it mean 'nymphers' aren't really flyfishing? No. That is up to the individual."

What part of that did you skip?

William
Why did you leave out the remainder of your quote? Perhaps I should quote it in it's entirety and maybe this will explain why we "skipped" it. ;)

inland said:
Does that mean 'nymphers' aren't being legal? No. Does that mean 'nymphers aren't being ethical? No. Does that mean 'nymphers' aren't having fun? No. Does it mean 'nymphers' aren't really flyfishing? No. That is up to the individual. I don't consider it flyfishing and therefore don't fish that way any longer. I realize that it is truly a duck. If I am going to use the method for steelhead I will darn well use a Centrepin Reel and have a blast. Nobody is saying it isn't fun, ethical, or legal if used properly.
So you begin by saying that yes, nymphers are indeed flyfishers, but conclude that you see it as a duck (gear fishing), and that it is not flyfishing. Those of us that disagree with you are simply disagreeing with you. As far as I'm concerned your argument is hosed! :p

Des
 

chadk

Be the guide...
#75
inland said:
Chad,

Once again another useless quip. Do you ever offer anything backed by personal opinion or experience?

William
A useless opionion vs a useless quip - they seem about equal to me. I have a very strong opinion and lots of personal experience with quips.

I've provided TONS of useful tips, pointers, suggestions, opinions, and valuable enteratianment :clown: to this site over the years - I have earned the right to post a few useless quips. :ray1:

It's all in fun, especially on a friday after a week like I've had... :beer2:
 
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