"Friend or Foe"

It appears that my continuing search for peace and quiet on a river will never end. In my opinion, what we don't need is more engine noise on our rivers. I really fishing a river the most way back when all guides and sport fishers drifted "downstream only" in their boats and rafts (including yours truly) with only oars for propulsion and control. When we reached the take-out our quiet fishing day was over. Some people are far too eager to turn every recreational activity into a carnival.

Good Fishing,
Les Johnson


youngish old guy
Amen Les. I cant stand jet boats, jet skis or even snowmobiles. I spend my life trying to get away from them. Nothing like motorized recreation in the wilderness! Its supposed to be where you go to get away from motors. But some can't leave theirs at home. Noise pollution has no place on the river. If pople rowed they wouldn't be so fat. Yes I'm a radical redneck environmentalist akin to Hayduke.:thumb

Mike Etgen

Not Quite A Luddite, But Can See One From Here
New River Mike

Re: "...Especially all of you rough & tumble bush-whackers who think fishing isn't fishing unless you've earned that run you're standing in."

I'm not sure I can entirely agree with that characterization. I'm not assuming that you're suggesting that everyone who seeks out some-of-the-way place is some kind of crazed fanatic. However, I would suggest that some flyfishermen (and outdoorsmen in general) enjoy some "spiritual satisfaction" that can be found when one is willing to get off the beaten path, however one does it.

I'm sure there is some number who measure success in terms of "degree of difficulty." That's why I'll never aspire to the "Team Rugged" experience. But I sure have a begrudging admiration for that spirit, and maybe if I was younger...

Speaking only for myself, some of my most enjoyable days on the water have been when I never saw another soul all day - unless it was a fishing buddy. I've sometimes experienced that on float trips through remote areas and sometimes by getting to some place that's been overlooked, and sometimes purely as a matter of timing.

Anyway, that's another reason this sport is so great - in the end, it's such an individual experience, and allows for so many definitions of enjoyment.

Something else I suspect is that all of us harbor some small remnant of that little boy or girl who had a piece of woodland or meadow to explore in our youth and imagined in our play that we were the only ones who knew about that (creek, fort, cave, etc.) Personally, I feel I grew up in a wonderful time. There was still a sense of security in the neighborhoods I lived in, and there were woods and fields and old abandoned homesteads to explore, not to mention vacant lots to play ball in. Today's kids, at least those who are reasonably well off, often grow up in relatively sterile surroundings, play only organized sports, and have parents who fear for their well-being if they aren't in line of sight at all times. I'm not suggesting this is right or wrong, but it may have something to do with that desire to find someplace, somewhere, that no one else seems to know about. And maybe it's a peculiarly American trait; we can only imagine what it was like to be part of the Lewis and Clark Expedition.

Yes, I think it's part of our nature, something that's healthy and very human.


Rob Blomquist

Formerly Tight Loops
Friend or Foe

If I saw one of these on the river, I would probably start throwing rocks.

There is already too much of this stuff around. Where is the peace and quiet of fly fishing?


Be the guide...
I think most of you are over reacting. There is no way a little 5HP motor is going to push one of those things (including 200+lbs of person and gear) up most of our rivers - probably just up to the first rapids and that's it.

Here are some places I do think they'd be almost justifiable:
* Protected Puget Sound bays (bring along your kayak paddle for backup - as well as other emergency precautions...)
* Large lakes where float tubes and pontoons are not practicle - especially in the wind. I'd take one of those fishing on Lake Sammamish or out on Potholes Res in a heart beat. Between all the high speed bass boats, ski doos, jet skis, ski boats - these would be down right peaceful out there. Add an electic motor mount on the front for quiet stalking and slow trolling and you are in business!

The only problem I see is that if I owned one (and I never will), is that I'd be too tempted to take it out on Lake WA during the Sockeye season. That little boat wouldn't do well around bigger faster boats in tight quarters (but you'd be able to skip the 2hr wait at the boat ramp). Same thing for the guys who try to go on rivers. Big jet boats would be my biggest fear.


Be the guide...
Friend or Foe

LOL - you'd throw rocks at people in a tiny "jet" boat in a river that probably has full sized jet boats, but you'd be tempted to pick a fight if you saw someone put a bumper sticker on someone's Hummer?:dunno
>"My concern is that some yahoo would take it way up some smaller river, tributary, or creek"

Well, JAWS, I can't say your fears are unfounded. I looked at the ad again and here is what it says, "Mokai is the sport boat that will let you sneak silently into a secluded sanctuary and then travel upstream to the next hot spot."

I think that's your hot spot they're after! And something tells me their definition of "silent" may differ from yours.

Then again, is this thing really new at all? If you look closely at this little craft, you'll see it's really just a Waverunner that you sit down inside instead of straddling. I haven't seen too many "yahoo" fishermen zipping upstream on Waverunners. Hold the phone. Now there's an idea . . .
NR Mike, I have great admiration for "rough & tumble bush-whackers" (great "jealousy" is probably more accurate). I used to be one. In my glory days I'd hike in 6 miles to fish some alpine lake for two hours, then do 6 miles back before dark. And it was uphill both ways (ok not really). I didn't believe there were fish in any stretch of river that couldn't be accessed without a machete (that's a figurative machete, I didn't have a vest pocket for a real one -- although I think Lawless does).

But then I got fat. And slow. And sore. And a job.

I'm still looking for remote spots. But I'm into efficiency now. I've thought about parachuting in, but then I'd still have to hike out (packing a big chute).

My pontoon boat changed my life forever. But I still need a shuttle, and since I usually fish alone . . .

Ok, I can see you guys don't like the Mokai, so I promise not to buy one. So how about this. I'll build a giant raft that I can put my truck on. I'll tie the raft onto my pontoon boat and drift it on down with me. Wait, I could probably sell these rafts! Anybody have Probasco's number handy?

Jim Wallace

Smells like low tide.
Bright Rivers, I hear ya. I'm feeling a bit "over-the-hill" myself lately. There are places i'd like to go to that would require quite a bit of effort and good physical conditioning in order to get there and back, but I guess that is what keeps them from getting overcrowded. That's one of the benefits of youth and/or a healthy, active lifestyle.
I'm surprised that more rivers don't have some entrepreneurial soul running a shuttle service on them. When Fishbait and I drifted the Bogy last week, we paid a guy (never even saw him or met him....Fishbait hooked up and arranged the deal over the phone) $15.00 cash to shuttle the rig down from the 101 launch to the Wilson pullout. An act of faith, but the rig was there waiting for us. Fishbait said the guy told him over the phone that he started moving vehicles after 8:30am. It would take only 10 shuttles to gross $150.00. That might have to be split two ways, as the shuttler would need a ride back up to the top, but i bet someone could devise a small and lightweight portable rack for a motor scooter or trail bike that he could use to haul the bike down on the empty boat-trailer, and then haul back up to the top with the bike. Considering all the unemployed people, many living near rivers, one would think that there would be at least one shuttle service on any floatable river with launches.
I just hope my knees hold out long enough to hike into many of the places I want to experience.
Well the sun's out, the lawns are drying off with a good breeze, its turning into a beautiful day, and I gotta go get to work!



Idiot Savant

Your point about this craft having some concerns in large water is exactly what will push it into smaller, traditionally quieter waters. Do you want some yayhoo running past you to go through a drift again, I don't. I have a hard bottom boat too, but opt for oars over motor unless everyone else on the lake is putting around under power.


Good things come to those who wade...

Mike Etgen

Not Quite A Luddite, But Can See One From Here
New River Mike

Bright Rivers...I hear ya, too. I'm so far down the other side of that hill it seems I'm always in the shade!;-)

I apologize if I seemed to pick on your particular remark. Your words were just a handy starting point for one of my semi-coherent ramblings. I should actually thank you - by the time I was done I was feeling pretty darned nostalgic for my boyhood, way back there on the other side of the slope.

Rob Blomquist

Formerly Tight Loops
Friend or Foe

I am not really crazy about jet boats clogging up all our waterways, carving out mudflats, and buzzing around.

Maybe that little motor can't handle the riffles that the big jets can, I am glad that some rivers are now free of jet boats, and I hope more are.

I am also really happy that personal watercraft are not allowed in National Parks, and on some lakes. I can only see that boats like this could be as obnoxious.


Be the guide...
Friend or Foe

"I am not really crazy about jet boats clogging up all our waterways, carving out mudflats, and buzzing around.

Maybe that little motor can't handle the riffles that the big jets can, I am glad that some rivers are now free of jet boats, and I hope more are.

I am also really happy that personal watercraft are not allowed in National Parks, and on some lakes. I can only see that boats like this could be as obnoxious."

Word. :thumb :beer2

Old Man

Just an Old Man
Will you older types quit talking about being over the hill. I have one foot on a banana peel and the other in the grave but I'm not ready to go yet. I can take you to places that you walk thru the woods a little way and set foot on the rivers where nobody else goes. I have a few dozen of those places tucked away in my brain.

But as for using one of those things on a river out here one would have to be out of his mind. The current out here would sweep one of those little motored things away. I think that they were maybe designed for those slow moving rivers in NY.


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